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Post by celebaglar on Feb 29, 2004 12:57:50 GMT
I'm not sure about this. As far as I can tell, the Targ cavalry can now travel almost twice as far as ordinary cavalry, while tiring half as fast.
This makes it arguably by far the most significant unit in the game, as it can cover large distances, fight and recruit. The change in garrison rules and the addition of the Targ citadel also reduce the problem of inferior numbers, and the addition of more horse herds makes it relatively easy to transform the Targ infantry into cavalry also.
I'm not saying I dislike the new Targ abilities, but I'm just not sure if any type of unit should be so far ahead of the others. In theory, it should also give Targ kings a considerable head start in every game they play in. Not only do they get a boost in the recruiting stages, but if cornered they can run much faster than any pursuer (except for other Targ cavalry, of course).
IMHO, one or two hours extra travel should give the Targ cavalry enough of a boost over normal cavalry to make it an interesting tactical unit, but not a decisive one.
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Natmus
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Fight the power!
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Post by Natmus on Feb 29, 2004 16:26:57 GMT
I have had some similar thoughts, but have been waiting for a bit more gaming before speaking on the subject. Having controlled a few Targ myself by now, it does seem to me that they move too fast. The old system had that horsemen moved a straight square in plains in an hour, and infantry moved the same square in 1.25 hours (since 4 straight infantry moves left you with two hours remaining). This gave cavalry a movement of 7 straight squares and infantry 6. It seems to me that I have gotten 9 or 10 moves out of Targ cavalry, or the equivalent of this, since there is very few places you can make that many straight moves in plains; I'll try it out when I get some time and a spare Targ to test it on. Even so, I would guess that the basic movement cost for Targ cavalry (and Wise, since they seem to move just as fast) is 0.75 or maybe 0.8. A basic movement cost of 0.75 would allow for 10 straight moves in a day, 0.8 for 9 moves. I think that Targ should be allowed something equivalent to 1 (one!) extra straight move per day, which a basic movement cost of 0.9 would give. This would give Targ an advantage, but not an very large one, and their corresponding handicap in forests should be adjusted downwards to match their lesser speed. Lastly, there's the question if I feel envy that Targ have become so fast now. Do I? OF COURSE!!!  But there's more than mere envy involved here, or we can all become Targ if they have become that strong. I just think that they upset the balance of the game at current settings. |
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Post by sparrowhawk on Mar 1, 2004 8:48:15 GMT
Noted. I'll tinker with the settings when I get some time to do some MU changes. Unfortunately tonight I have about 3-4 hours worth of real work to do, so no MU-ing for me  |
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Post by daiabolical on Mar 3, 2004 7:31:52 GMT
One extra move should be all, not two. I'm still not sure if it's two or three extra straight moves they make at present, has anybody put them to a controlled test? At present time there's three wise. Lorgrim always gets recruited late, so it's not him that is a problem, but Rorthrorn and in particular the Spider can have a significant influence on the game in the recruitment phase. But I don't understand why their speed were set up in the first place, were there any need for that? I agree with Natmus from the thread about Martolax. I think wise are too fast as well as Targ. Unless there is one as easily accesible as the spider and Rorthron in all four corners, they can seriously imbalance the recruiting phase. In Treble Deal I started South East less than a day above Dawn and Fernando started South West somewhere. Yet he managed to recruit Trorn and Tujarg with Rorthron before I could reach them. I accept he probably used Cup of Dawns, (which seem easier to come by in this release?) but still. In the interest of Balance they either need to be made slower or the availability equal for all four quadrants. |
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Ringthane
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Post by Ringthane on Mar 3, 2004 8:59:35 GMT
yeah, leave lorgrim where he is, move spider to the pass of broken crowns, lower rorthron a bit into the domain of gard and place some female wise around moonhenge, moving fawkrin the assassin to glorim...
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Post by celebaglar on Mar 3, 2004 12:18:04 GMT
I'd prefer the solution of having four Wise spread obe in each quarter to that of slowing them down. I don't mind the idea of a fast unit as it increases the tactical challenge and means people won't feel so comfortable leaving unrecruited characters behind the front lines to last, as the Wise are more than capable of sneaking in and getting them first.
However, if you're going to balance out the distribution of characters on the map, then one of the SE dragons would also have to move to the SW, probably Zerin.
OTOH, I kinda like the idea of having different quadrants, each with their strengths and weaknesses.
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Ringthane
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Post by Ringthane on Mar 3, 2004 12:22:09 GMT
Technically Zerin and Martolax are in different quadrants... still sticking to random xeno deployment, extending the idea to include the Wise.
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Post by sparrowhawk on Mar 3, 2004 12:33:38 GMT
yeah, leave lorgrim where he is, move spider to the pass of broken crowns, lower rorthron a bit into the domain of gard and place some female wise around moonhenge, moving fawkrin the assassin to glorim... Female Wise? That sounds like a request for Wayne - way beyond my capabilities. But I could maybe use the Shareth gfx in the interim, to differentiate them? The positioning of Wise sounds good - but I won't do it until everyone has had a chance to state their opinion. Otherwise I know what will happen... |
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Ringthane
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Post by Ringthane on Mar 3, 2004 14:11:26 GMT
In the meantime ;D anything prevents you from developing a sidetrack to random deployment? ;D I know, I know. Just want you to have a bit of life besides RL...  |
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Post by celebaglar on Mar 3, 2004 14:45:00 GMT
Technically Zerin and Martolax are in different quadrants... still sticking to random xeno deployment, extending the idea to include the Wise. I don't think so. Zerin is south and east of Marakith, and according to my calculations that puts her in the SE quadrant. The halfway mark between north and south is between Marakith and Kumar, and the halfway mark east/west is west of Marakith. Martolax is definitely in the SE quadrant, being no more than a stone's throw from Xajorkith. |
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Matija
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Post by Matija on Mar 4, 2004 21:42:24 GMT
Female Wise? That sounds like a request for Wayne - way beyond my capabilities. But I could maybe use the Shareth gfx in the interim, to differentiate them? The positioning of Wise sounds good - but I won't do it until everyone has had a chance to state their opinion. Otherwise I know what will happen... Female wise are called witches, I believe. |
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Ringthane
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Post by Ringthane on Mar 4, 2004 22:06:15 GMT
Bruxas in portuguese ;D Sounds eerie huh?
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Post by ladyhawke on Mar 5, 2004 13:21:20 GMT
Female wise are called witches, I believe. This is one subject I had to figure out for my novel. I have kept the Wise all male. And there is a very good reason behind this. Can't wait to reveal it!  |
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Post by sparrowhawk on Mar 5, 2004 13:55:18 GMT
Because they don't get out much? |
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Ringthane
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Post by Ringthane on Mar 5, 2004 14:25:05 GMT
Make those robes dense and dark ;D
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