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Post by celebaglar on Jul 26, 2004 11:04:53 GMT
I agree that this would solve part of the issue. However do people object to an army being able to move/rest/move/rest/move on plains. Or more importantly move/rest/disband/move which allows the lord to escape with more difficulty to find. If they are UE to start with, yes, that would be objectionable. Ending up UE should be a serious penalty, not something you can get away from in a day. Edit: What I'm saying is that anything which can be achieved by <REST><MOVE><REST><MOVE>, but not by <REST><REST><MOVE><MOVE> is an abuse of the system. I agree with Mads that the feature can be abused, specially in mountains where the pursuer would be paying for the movement big time, and in forests where three moves could well hide a army well enough to let them escape. Negative energy with a "zeroing" modifier at the beginning of each day sounds good to me. The modifier would ensure that we don't get back to the state of being stuck somewhere forever, and the negative energy would make sure that one does not use energy which does not exist unless it is the last move of the day (which as Mads said, is a tradition that must be kept). With the "Rest" feature, we no longer need to make sure there is minimal energy present at the beginning of each day.
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Natmus
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Post by Natmus on Sept 21, 2004 8:50:42 GMT
It seems to me that the resting option that should allow players to no to become all bogged down can be abused. An UE army caught by strong opponents can now make a getaway into, for example, mountains or forests, and with a little luck escape the pursuers by first resting an hour, gain energy to make a move, rest an hour and then make another move (and depending on terrain even repeat this one more time). Two moves in forests or mountains can shake off many pursuers, and certainly deplete their energy severely. The problem is that UE is a absolute bottom for energy. Even with just a fraction of an energy point left it is possible to make a diagonal move into mountains (a good and timehonoured LoM tradition), but you only lose the fraction of an energy point, and an hour's rest can give you another fraction of an energy point, allowing you to repeat the diagonal move into mountains. The Rest option is a good idea, but something should be done to stop this way to abuse it. Could the UE be a flexible bottom, so that doing a tough move with only a fraction of an energy point would leave you needfull of several hours of rest afterwards? I think this still is an issue, J-Y. Any thoughts on how to solve it? (When you have the time, of course )
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Post by sparrowhawk on Sept 21, 2004 10:23:35 GMT
To be honest no. I'll have a think on it once I've finished makining the effects of disease optional.
One possibility (and I have not read the thread above recently so I may be repeating myself/someone else here) is to have UE troops who are in battle start at, say, 3 hours left. That way they could stagger 3 squares on plains, but only 1 square on mountains, as that uses 4 hours (from memory). More on a diagonal.
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SkulkrinBait
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Post by SkulkrinBait on Sept 21, 2004 11:30:49 GMT
What about allowing negative values for energy? That way let's say you have 1 energy point and move into mountains diagonally using say 5 points, giving minus 4. resting one hour gives you back say 3 points so you'd need to rest two hours before moving etc.
Or you could work out the energy calculation before moving so if it would leave you with negative energy the move button is greyed out.
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Post by sparrowhawk on Sept 21, 2004 12:00:17 GMT
Or you could work out the energy calculation before moving so if it would leave you with negative energy the move button is greyed out. What? And have Mads never speak to me again? The last hour of the day diagonal move is his Holy of Holies!
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Natmus
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Post by Natmus on Sept 21, 2004 12:08:47 GMT
What? And have Mads never speak to me again? The last hour of the day diagonal move is his Holy of Holies! Indeed, it is Sacrosant, Mos Maiorum and an integral part of all LoMdom. However, as I have suggested before, negative energy could be the solution. It would work as any move is legal as long as the character has (any) positive energy and (any amount of) time remaining. However, if the character lands on negative energy, no more moves would be possible even if there is time remaining. Then resting would not be limited to only one hour to regain positive energy, but several hours of rest would be needed. Also any end of turn would reset negative energy levels to either zero or perhaps 1, so the character doesn't start next day at negative energy. Would this make sense?
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Post by sparrowhawk on Sept 21, 2004 12:20:18 GMT
I think so. I need to think through the whole process, what scripts are affected, how this impacts other parts of the database or code and with what effects.
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Freiegeister
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Post by Freiegeister on Sept 21, 2004 21:26:53 GMT
I like the way it is, but if you can do something like make rest ing take two hours and give you just enough energy to move twice on plains that would be still be ok.
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Matija
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Post by Matija on Sept 22, 2004 5:16:19 GMT
Indeed, it is Sacrosant, Mos Maiorum and an integral part of all LoMdom. However, as I have suggested before, negative energy could be the solution. It would work as any move is legal as long as the character has (any) positive energy and (any amount of) time remaining. However, if the character lands on negative energy, no more moves would be possible even if there is time remaining. Then resting would not be limited to only one hour to regain positive energy, but several hours of rest would be needed. Also any end of turn would reset negative energy levels to either zero or perhaps 1, so the character doesn't start next day at negative energy. Would this make sense? Why shouldn't he start with neg. energy? He'd just have to rest some more.
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Natmus
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Post by Natmus on Sept 22, 2004 7:26:16 GMT
Why shouldn't he start with neg. energy? He'd just have to rest some more. To begin with I have not calculated the the costs of a diagonal move across mountains, but I still think at least one move of any type per day should be possible, and I think that at least one diagonal move across mountains would make it impossible to rest enough during a day to move further the next day. Secondly, I feel that the 17 hours of night between each turn should give the characters at least a little rest, just to dispell my suspicion that characters party-hearty all night
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Matija
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Post by Matija on Sept 22, 2004 7:41:57 GMT
I agree some energy should be regained during the night, even when travelling all day.
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