[DROPPED]Double Jeopardy

[merlin]

I've been told this is not a bug, but it doesn't half look and feel like one, and thus in my mind, is very wrong.

In my game "Merlin's Revenge", Preims has Lord Blood in battle against me at a neutral citadel. Actually he has Blood and Valethor against my Korinel and The plainsman.

During the night's battle Blood looks to have had two bites at the cherry on both my lords. Both with devastating affect. Blood is Utterly Courageous but Tired And his riders are tired.

My lords are very invigorated and Courageous. And very invigorated and Very courageous. Blood is kicking Culo! of both. 2:1 against courageous

Now, I don't know if the numbers stack up or not, don't care that much, but the double night entry is really annoying and confusing. It really should only show the total night's work as with it does look like he's getting two shots...

The reality is I know he's not getting an advantage as my lords also have the two records, but it just looks plain wrong!

[premis]

Over the night one my attack and your counterattack happened. And when you invoked a night your 2 lords attacked mine and i inflicted 2 conterattacks on your 2 lords..Consider that attack is 20-30% more powerfull than counterattack also riders are about 25% more efficient than warriors...

[celebaglar]

Merlin, bear in mind that each turn has two "nights": one after you have taken your turn and another after your opponent has taken his. The result is that unless your opponent moves his armies away, you will get two rounds of fighting, which is what you see reported.

If the results were summarised into one single battle report, how would one know if he is seeing the result of one or two rounds of fighting?

As it happens, I think J-Y will eventually change the battle report system again to something more in line with the original LoM style. The issue has been discussed at length somewhere in the suggestions section, I believe.

This doesn't explain why your armies are getting so badly beaten. For that, bear in mind that courage is much more important than fitness. A tired contingent led by an UC lord will usually beat one which is utterly invigorated but led by someone courageous or less. My system for avoiding disappointment is to always engage with superior numbers or else not at all, and always fight with UC lords wherever possible.

[merlin]

Celebaglar said:

Merlin, bear in mind that each turn has two "nights": one after you have taken your turn and another after your opponent has taken his. The result is that unless your opponent moves his armies away, you will get two rounds of fighting, which is what you see reported.

Ah, that makes sense... didn't know that is what happened. Maybe the second attack should br labelled so in order to avoid confusion.

If the results were summarised into one single battle report, how would one know if he is seeing the result of one or two rounds of fighting?

As it happens, I think J-Y will eventually change the battle report system again to something more in line with the original LoM style. The issue has been discussed at length somewhere in the suggestions section, I believe.

This doesn't explain why your armies are getting so badly beaten. For that, bear in mind that courage is much more important than fitness. A tired contingent led by an UC lord will usually beat one which is utterly invigorated but led by someone courageous or less. My system for avoiding disappointment is to always engage with superior numbers or else not at all, and always fight with UC lords wherever possible.

Hmmm...

[Ringthane]

Told ya

[sparrowhawk]

An improved text-based breakdown of the info with simplified and aggregated information is planned for the next release, but I have not started on it yet.

So little time at the moment

[Freiegeister]

Correct me if I am wrong. At the end of each player's turn - are every players' Lords and strongholds included in the processing?

For example, troop generation appears to be multiplied according to the number of players, is battle damage the same?

[sparrowhawk]

Actually, if troop regeneration is supposed to be averaged out over the number of live players, so you should always get roughly the same number of troops each night.

Battles are fought between all enemies, every night. So if we were playing a 3 player game against, say Merlin, and you and Merlin were in combat somewhere, that squirmish would have battle records generated at the end of my turn.

[Freiegeister]

Jean-Yves said:

Actually, if troop regeneration is supposed to be averaged out over the number of live players, so you should always get roughly the same number of troops each night.

Battles are fought between all enemies, every night. So if we were playing a 3 player game against, say Merlin, and you and Merlin were in combat somewhere, that squirmish would have battle records generated at the end of my turn.

Can I make a big suggestion? At the end of each players turn, only process that players lords and holdings and any lord, stronghold, object they have attacked or affected?

Here's why?
Suppose you have 4 players.
A
B
C
D

A surprise attacks one of Ds lords with as superior force: This lord gets hammered for 3 nights.
D finally gets a turn and reinforces with superior numbers: A gets hammered for one turn.

Sound a little unfair?

This effect would be amplified if you ever implemented allowing games with more than 4 players.

Non-aligned lords, NPCs, roaming bands of wolves, barbarians, etc; could be processed at the end of each round.

This would simplify the battle reports as you would only get your attack and then a counter attack if the opponent chose to continue. Troop regeneration would only occur once in a round and be consistent no matter how many players are involved.

[Natmus]

I think we have had this one up before. I remember that J-Y had a (horrible ) solution, where only the armies of the player that had had his/her turn attacked during the night, and their opponents had no defensive blow. I suffered against LadyHawke under this, and Ringthane suffered against me, before it was set back to the old way.

But perhaps it could be modified, so that only the forces of the player that has ended his turn AND their opponents have an attack. For a prolonged battle, even in four-player games, this will lead to only two rounds of battle per game-day. In the event of three different forces in one square, ther would be three rounds per game-day.