kae
Luxor Member
Posts: 638
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Post by kae on Aug 9, 2007 17:01:53 GMT
I like it. While it can provide some frustrating circumstances and I'm sure other alliances won't like the 'no comp for clearing' part, it is clean and simple.
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inyati
Morkin Admin
Aqua profunda est quieta
Posts: 4,310
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Post by inyati on Aug 9, 2007 17:03:06 GMT
I cleared an isle using 600 LWS ;D and couldn't colo it for some 40 hours. By those rules i had not valid claim for it. Someone else could also have done the same. What if he then overcolonised the same island from you, claiming to have spent 1000 LWS? Morkins response would be: Tough luck! That island is ours by right. Shendemiar, the Freaking-Flamable-Fin got their first! ITS OURS! But if someone else got their first, and you over colonised, then we'd help in you keeping the island, but would not go as far as threaten war over the matter. But HEI! Didnt you colonise the island after all?
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Shendemiar
Morkin Admin
Mmmm, free goo!
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Post by Shendemiar on Aug 9, 2007 17:03:29 GMT
But in general VERY good post. Exalts for Inyati!
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Shendemiar
Morkin Admin
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Post by Shendemiar on Aug 9, 2007 17:05:51 GMT
I cleared an isle using 600 LWS ;D and couldn't colo it for some 40 hours. By those rules i had not valid claim for it. Someone else could also have done the same. What if he then overcolonised the same island from you, claiming to have spent 1000 LWS? Morkins response would be: Tough luck! That island is ours by right. Shendemiar, the Freaking-Flamable-Fin got their first! ITS OURS! But if someone else got their first, and you over colonised, then we'd help in you keeping the island, but would not go as far as threaten war over the matter. But HEI! Didnt you colonise the island after all? I basically cleared in 2 hour frame but then failed 10 colo attempts... And i could prove no-one else had attacke it in meanwhile (counting casualties and psy reports) And i did get (as and nobody else was interested of 1000 pointer undefended 1-wall 1-MH isle for 40 hours ;D Or maybe they realized someone would have been pissed if they took it ;D )
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Shendemiar
Morkin Admin
Mmmm, free goo!
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Post by Shendemiar on Aug 9, 2007 17:06:37 GMT
Psy reports lol!
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inyati
Morkin Admin
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Post by inyati on Aug 9, 2007 17:11:54 GMT
I've tried that, but it makes my head hurt ;D
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Post by Tomthebuffalo on Aug 9, 2007 17:25:40 GMT
So if I see an isle I like... (heavily defended) Wait for someone else to clear it, then sneak in? If I time it right, and colonise the undefended isle, I get the full backing from the alliance, that I should offer no compensation. I suppose that could work in my favour... But what would I say when the inevitable demands start coming about. Am I able to just say.. message Inyati - his idea not mine! ;D
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inyati
Morkin Admin
Aqua profunda est quieta
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Post by inyati on Aug 9, 2007 17:44:04 GMT
;D We will not take such reports under consideration from either part , for Morkin would stick to the rule that claims are based on Island Possession (1st rule), not what it took to colonise the island.
Let me put it another way: We are willing to pay for an island that we have overcolonised (but not got war over the issue), but we are not willing to pay if we colonise first. That would be like paying to keep something that is already mine.
Or in another fashion: We both try our luck at conquering a girl and use every trick possible to show off how we feel for her. But I get to sleep with her first! Would I have to pay you some compensation for your frustated effort? A beer perhaps? Would you pay me, or offer me some sort of excuse if the tables where turned? ;D
Ok what if people submit senarios here and I try to answer according to the guide lines I'm proposing? There could be flaws or small details we could add to help diplomats in future disputes.
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Arminius
Morkin Admin
Ich bin Bl?cher
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Post by Arminius on Aug 9, 2007 19:04:56 GMT
The problem is that there is incomplete information. When you see an unowned isle with no troops, has somebody else cleared them? Did the previous owner not bother with an army, or suicided into somebody else? Do you decide not to colonise because you assume the first case?
Clearing an isle is expensive and risky. It is risky because you can't tell other people who might want the isle what you're doing, and you can't ask around who cleared an isle you spotted. Hence my view that I don't care who did what. If I have a colony ship heading for an isle, I'm not interested in what happened with it beforehand. Only if I know that the previous owner's alliance is at war with some other alliance then I would do out of courtesy. But that's rare with unowned isles, and as I don't steal isles from active players it's not an issue.
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McGoogus
Luxor Member
McGorgeous
Posts: 548
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Post by McGoogus on Aug 9, 2007 19:17:37 GMT
I don't think that any claim on an isle is relevant until the main house is built to lvl 2. if you take an isle without cats then i think its yours, likewise if someone takes an isle from me while the main house is building then i'd see it as my bad luck. In a scenario where one person catted me and an unrelated player colo'd the isle before i could rebuild, i would hold the person who sent the cats responsible for all losses and expenses. I agree completely. If the main house isn't yet at level 2, then I don't consider the isle to be owned and if anyone (be it myself or another) colos the isle before the house is up, I consider that to be fair game. No rules broken. Just poor (or good) luck. I wouldn't expect compensation, but it would be nice.
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Arminius
Morkin Admin
Ich bin Bl?cher
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Post by Arminius on Aug 9, 2007 19:30:16 GMT
Yes, I think I could agree with that.
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AeroS
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Timmons[HAWK]
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Post by AeroS on Aug 9, 2007 21:28:25 GMT
We aren't the only ones who have to agree to this. If I succesfully colo an island that a DIGG member cleared but failed to colo, I will tell them that I don't owe them any comp and I will be keeping the island. How well do you think that will go over?
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Post by Gornall on Aug 9, 2007 21:29:59 GMT
Not quite. Clearing an isle means nothing. Your flag on the main house stakes your claim. - you clear, somebody else takes -- tough luck - somebody else clears, you take -- lucky you - you take, somebody else takes over -- you get island back OR compensation - somebody takes isle, you over-take -- you pay compensation OR return island I Don't agree with the clearing part. You clear an isle and some one takes it Id be seriously annoyed. Especially considering it can cost you a a good deal of units.
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Arminius
Morkin Admin
Ich bin Bl?cher
Posts: 4,148
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Post by Arminius on Aug 9, 2007 21:40:55 GMT
I Don't agree with the clearing part. You clear an isle and some one takes it Id be seriously annoyed. Especially considering it can cost you a a good deal of units. But for the reasons explained above it is not a failsafe criterion. Also, this is a diplomatic guideline to give us some help in sorting out conflicts. As such it would be displayed on our profile, to answer Aero's concerns. And yes, once we have agreed on adopting it, if you take an isle somebody else cleared you'd have the backing of the alliance when they have a go at you.
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Arminius
Morkin Admin
Ich bin Bl?cher
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Post by Arminius on Aug 9, 2007 21:43:10 GMT
Or in another fashion: We both try our luck at conquering a girl and use every trick possible to show off how we feel for her. But I get to sleep with her first! Would I have to pay you some compensation for your frustated effort? A beer perhaps? Would you pay me, or offer me some sort of excuse if the tables where turned? ;D From what I've heard from DD, you'd offer him your IK account.
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