DIGG Split Potential

[Clausewitz]

Attained from the highest levels. As always, don't ask how. This conversation took place between DIGG Admins...

I can't copy and paste a forum page well, so here's the order of conversation, verbatim, nothing omitted...

1. Phil299, in response to intelligence report they received...
"Operatives within Valheru are reporting that Valheru is being actively recruited for the Pantheon merger.

They're being told that respective alliances will work relatively autonomously, and devolve back into their respective alliances once the war is over.

Merda! Merda! Merda! ..that is one convincing way to pull them in...this is starting to look more touch and go"

2. Loafnut
"I just love how all these alliances will ally with cheaters just over their jealously of us.

Looks like we are doing a Merdoso! job with our hegemony keeping the minor powers warring one another."

3. Loafnut again
"Phil, we need to face the music here. We must split, sooner rather than later."

4. Meatpopsicle
"How the Chiavata! is splitting going to help?"

5. Phil299
"under these circumstances not at all..if anything we need to draw our outer orbit digg friends in to digg ..dugg and aces for example who will be targeted next no doubt...unless what the admirals suggested.... that morkin would be next but that would be a tall order don't you think.

No splitting is not an option now ..loaf I seriously thought about it but with this collective forming we have to face the music together."

6. Loafnut
"I feel strongly that moving ourselves into the #2 spot will cause quite a bit of fracturing within Pantheon.

I also feel strongly that relations with morkin will never be stable until we are out of the #1 rank."

7. Scoots
"I agree. We can play the same game as smaller alliances that are tied in together. The big difference is Pantheon will have the Merda! storm thrown at them. Hell it would even be fun to play for a week or two starting IK forum topics where we claim Pantheon is ruining the game. Too bad diggers would not ever stoop to that level."

8. Meatpopsicle
"These forums are our glue. Hell, I barely do anything through the IK interface other than queue a building and read an IGM.
Split along Ocean regions in game. Aside from the 1 day hiccup of people diverting into new alliances, most of us probably wouldn't even notice as long as the forum remained the same.

But o14 should remain the region with the DIGG name. =)"

9. scoots
"Split along ocean guideline. perfect. or along new regions. Does not matter. We will have about 4-5 diggs in the top 15. Hell we do most things along regional line anyway in this game."

10. Loafnut
"I was thinking we don't even have to a big ocean by ocean split. Just pull enough points into something else to be #2. No need to make this official.

Maybe [Kennel] for the big dogs."

Marc, I think I've just effectively raised the bar on covert intel ops

[Aesir]

Just to be devils advocate Clause(aka i still have admin level forum access.. )

theyve called for a cooling off period on this plan while they wait for the pantheon merger to settle. i would bet my left nut Digg doesnt split.. regardless of who says what, theyre too keen on being number one.

and you know how phil is.. he's got the "people will know we're better than pantheon.... once we win" sort of attitude right now.

I wouldnt give this too much thought for the time being.

[Clausewitz]

Very legit counterpoint. But that conversation occurred in the past 2 hours... it sounds as if it was discussed before and relatively dismissed, though I expect the Admins may come out supporting it to Staff now...

When Phil is deadset against something, it has a high likelihood not to happen.

Though it seems relevant, and there is obviously the potential...

[ashimar]

Yes, yes, Ryan, my compliments for a job well done. Admin righst to a forum or not.

So, relations with morkin will not be stable unless Digg is no longer rank 1. That's interesting although I fail to see the reasoning behind it.

And the admirals said Morkin would be next for what...A Digg attck or being under attck from Pantheon. This non native speaker doesn't see it entirely in the sentence.

[Clausewitz]

I have no DIGG Admin privileges. No access privileges to their forums whatsoever Pulled a rabbit out of my hat through "other means". Just do not let those words find their way back to DIGG under any circumstances, or I'll have some tough questions to answer...

Regarding Loafnut's comment about DIGG-Morkin never being strong until DIGG is out of #1 - I agree, it is completely unsubstantiated and unfounded. Loafnut misunderstands the source of any perceived "distance" in the relationship.

Regarding the "Morkin should be next" comment, my understand was it was in regards to the Admirals having discussed that Morkin should merge with DIGG.

[Freiegeister]

clausewitz said:

Just do not let those words find their way back to DIGG under any circumstances, or I'll have some tough questions to answer...

I could imagine their claims over your islands may extend beyond taking them if you lose them.

[Clausewitz]

freiegeister said:

clausewitz said:

Just do not let those words find their way back to DIGG under any circumstances, or I'll have some tough questions to answer...

I could imagine their claims over your islands may extend beyond taking them if you lose them.

"Every warrior dreams of a good death. Some get impatient waiting for it to come to them, and go seeking it."
-Some dead guy

This cloak-and-dagger is a dangerous game, indeed. I do so knowing that for the good of Morkin, it would have to be disavowed and an expulsion follow shortly.

My death would not be swift, I assure you My slayer would gain 89 5-pt islands, only after paying dearly for every inch of ground.

[Freiegeister]

clausewitz said:

freiegeister said:

This cloak-and-dagger is a dangerous game, indeed. I do so knowing that for the good of Morkin, it would have to be disavowed and an expulsion follow shortly.

My death would not be swift, I assure you My slayer would gain 89 5-pt islands, only after paying dearly for every inch of ground.

I would suggest then not getting caught, not that we expect you to.

[Arminius]

This is what I suggested to Dan/fhloop/loafnut:

I think these guys are too worried about an all-powerful Digg. I suggest the following to make them feel less worried:

1. Split into two or three smaller alliances. DIGG proper, with experienced and larger players, then one with smaller ones, and one with all the newcomers. Obviously you need a few experienced players in all of them for training and leadership.

2. Clarify and publish your policies, eg on over-colos and claims on islands. Abandon the 'once Digg, always Digg' mantra for islands.

3. Document the capabilities of your tools. I guess many players don't know what you've got and overestimate their power, thus viewing it as cheating.

These things would show that you don't intend to dominate and choke the server, and would take the wind out of the opposition's sails.

They would also coincide with some of your goals.

[Clausewitz]

Further germane conversation from phil299...

"I must say that morkin do indeed act in a stand offish way....Good com's with them are difficult even for me.

I also think that morkin have been less than perfect partners for some while now.

The anger in digg currently is caused directly by the RK affair..it has, like it did to loqtor and gorbag, spoiled the game for many.

The events , in my book are the worst I can recall, we, with morkins direct support or even provoked by them have been more responsive to lesser crimes.
What pisses me off is that morkin stood to one side when obviously the orcs were being picked apart by bought accounts...while the architects of the event then came in to pick up all the cleared islands...8 days..we waited for those ,perceived on the server , as the moral judges, sat on there hands and said nought...then digg steps in only to see unknown dissolve and pantheon accept the triad in.

It feels like we have been deceived by are pact partners pantheon and left to fight the injustice on our own by morkin.

Digg is currently in a state of shock...and there is tiredness and frustration at all levels, but especially staff.

I think the die is cast and future events could not now be changed by me or anyone else in digg."

Looks like events are coming to a head. We either need to declare solidarity with DIGG to give them a much-needed show of support, or if we believe a DIGG-humbling would be good for the server, we should dissolve the pact for the psychological impact.

[Arminius]

That just shows how much of the game is perception... and hard facts are never available.

But I think we acted right; trying for a diplomatic solution and not jumping the gun at every opportunity. We're not the IK police after all, and if Digg feel they have to wait for us to do stuff then that's not our problem.

[Natmus]

Also, there were a few Morkins who seriously discussed forming a task force to go after rhinokiller regardless of the rest of the larger Morkin group. But as these talks were held in private, nothing of this is known outside the inner Morkin group before now.

[SkulkrinBait]

We didn't fight to save Orc as Orc bully new players, that was the reason I decided eventually to stay out of it anyway.

As stated above, we're not the IK police. Did they try to get the AMC in involved?

[Arminius]

Don't think so, no.

[AeroS]

They bring this on themselves. They act as if we abandoned them when the whole time they act against the whole rest of the server. Phils message only shows their expectation of us to follow them into every war like lap dogs. Are we DIGG's to command? When did we ever proclaim to be the moral judges of this server?
This is the inflated ego of Phil. I really believe he feels slighted because we didn't step in. How did we deceive him? Did DIGG actually go after those purchased accounts full force or is he griping that we did the same as they did...sit on their hands. In the end, no one acted and he wants to blame us.
Who ever set up DIGGs original structure must have done a fantastic job. I doubt DIGG could survive with its present leadership with out a sound internal structure.

EDIT: I know I have to stop DIGG bashing sometime but I'm not ready yet. Give me another week.